Pig Industry - Biodigestores nopals, animals and revaluation of waste - Management


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27/12/2006

fernandezsalas
Argentina

Dear Rodrigo, was completely believed that in the biodigestores developments, that made it was to contribute with the ecology, the future, to reduce the costs, getting fertilizers for a better production, and biogas. What takes me to tell you vastly grateful for the little thing that you are giving, here I believe -if I don't make a mistake - any type of lucrative interest doesn't exist, all those that offer ourselves to the development of this in an or another way, don't seek to enrich. I thank you, but I inform you that you didn't tell us absolutely anything that us -all - we already know. All this information is free, gratuitous, and it is in all sides. Thank you.

27/12/2006

Rodrigo Wayland
Chile

Sr (Srta) Fernadez Rooms:

In relation to their comments.

I believe a great difference it exists in the participants in this forum, some have curiosity for the topic and they want to know a little but, others are profesonales of the area, they know in theoretical form the topic or they have visited some plants. In my non alone case I am also an engineer in foods environmental engineer and professor so much univesitario of pre and post degree, we are devoted to this topic professionally building and designing teams and facilities. It is very direfente to speak of the constuccion of a house or their architecture that contruirla.

The renewable energy won't be taken into account by ecological conscience, you can see it in it USES the main pollutant in the world, but for the biggest cost in the petroleum insentiva their use. While one doesn't have a vision of long term for their desarrrollo so much commercial as environmentally sustainable, alone they will be good intentions.

Sustainable it implies that a resource can be exploited social, environmental, technological and economically. This is the type of projects that develops my company.

It is not enough that some few environmentalists decide to spend a little more and to use electric cars or to recycle something of garbage. That is alone symbolic, a dozen exists or more than reasons for those which the renewable energy not you desarrolllan, not only technical. From public officials' corruption with the oil companies, until commercial patents and taxes.

If you produce their energy, how does it collect the revenue the taxes to fuels or electricity?

27/12/2006

Christian Rodriguez
Peru

Dear Mr. Wayland:
I have understood that cultivations of Nopals are given in areas with few sources of water, and that to maintain an acceptable level of solids in the Digestor, it is necessary to ADD water. For what I read in a previous answer, a digestor of 100 m3 feeds him with 1 tn of dry matter, I imagine that it will maintain a concentration of the 10 ~ 15 of Total Solids, and for ende a Hydraulic time of Retention of 10 to 15 days. Dice those parameters, he/she would mean that daily they would be required among 5,5 to 9 m3 of water to maintain this digestor type.
Is my appreciation correct?
Now then, the same necessity to control the water toward the tunales, usually, makes require systems of watering tecnificado (for leak) in these systems. The inconvenience of these teams is the possibility of obstruction of the mouthpieces, for what you/they usually filter before entering to the system of Watering.
Does their proposal contemplate the inclusion of filtrate systems to incorporate the nutrients from the Efluente to the watering? If it is this way, based on their experience, he/she will Have a reference of cost of Investment of the Sist. of Filtrate in front of production of nutritious (as relationship NPK)?
Finally, it interests me to be able to apply their system in a cochineal farm, but regrettably, the electric power is a restrictive one.
Will he/she have a relationship Kw-hr consumed vs m3 Biogas taken place as reference?
Thanking of antemando their answers, I not say goodbye without before to wish him a Happy Year 2007

28/12/2006

Carlos Alberto Cardona Cardona
Colombia

Mr. Victor Cantarero.

A thousand thank you for their comments. At the moment I have BECOLSUB for the despulpado and handling the honeys with the cherry, but I find interesting the handling that you propose, since with the annual production of coffee it could reach to about 1400 m3 of biogas, not you how so important it is this figure. I also belong to the committee municpal of coffee of the munipio of Genova department of the Quindio, that which allows me to transmit to a great number of coffee this valuable contribution, and to try with the departmental committee and the national federation of coffee so that you investique on this topic under the conditions of our means, since up to now I ignore if some investigation exists in this respect.
The chats that very kindly offers me, he/she would thank their shipment.
A thousand thank you.

Carlos A. Cardona C.

28/12/2006

Victor
Nicaragua

good morning Mr. Cardona.
My cordial greetings for you.

In Colombia, the Federation of Coffee grower made an excellent investigation work for the use of the beneficiary's of coffee waters honeys, during more than 10 years. It leaves of that work the Doctors they directed it Jaime Zuluaga and Diego Zambrano, and that work is forced to take it into account for anyone that works in treatment of the beneficiary's waters. The investigation combines biodigestores plastic type sausage Plastilona, with tanks of those that are used for storage of water (modified).

The important thing is not to neglect the advance of the investigation. I will thank him if he/she makes me arrive their mail to send him the chat.

That he/she has a happy navidad and Happy New Year.

28/12/2006

Rodrigo Wayland
Chile

Sr Rodriguez, in having restored to their consultation:
Indeed, he/she should add water to the system, I would say nearer to 4 or 5 m3. Nevertheless, it is the same water that you use to water the nopals. That is to say, if before it used 5 m3 of a channel to water the nopals, these same ones 5m3 use them for the reactor, and then the efuente which is richer in nutritious - it uses it in the nopals.
I explain to him: if you enter 1 rhyme it bases dry of nopals, it contains a 80-88 of water, 8.5 rhyme (aprox. of water), it adds 5 tons more than water (5 m3 aprox) in the reactor. As the solid matter it only generates gas, the water it is liberated, reason why in the efluente he/she has 13,5 rhyme (aprox) of water with something of suspended solid, which is detachable in simple form. It doesn't only recover the water entered to the process, also the water that the palette contains (penca).
As for the watering for leak, the material efluente can contain fibers, palette remains, silt, something of biogas and it dilutes. The fibers and palette remains are quite big as particulado, reason why a sieve will allow the separation. The silt has a bigger density and its decantación speed is quick, it will be in the bottom of the pond. The liquid sobrenadante contains a great quantity of bacterias anaeróbicas, which die quickly in contact with the air, only need to air the system a little for I bubble. Lastly, it can subject the fluid to a normal filtrate for any system for leak. Of course, if it uses water of a channel, of all way should filter before distributing the watering, it can use these same teams.
This system is designed and built for companies that process cochineal, I am sure he/she knows the company Roeper of Chile. Company that processes cochineal and it exports coloring.
In relation to the energy consumption, it is approximately a 3-4 of the biogas taken place for conditions mesófilas and a 10 for conditions termófilas.
A ton BS: it generates rough some 2.450.000 kcal, near about 2.848 kw-h.
As for to the electricity: the biogas can transform it in electricity with generating groups. Similar to what happens with vehicles to natural gas.
Thanking their greetings, and wanting the success.

Rodrigo Wayland

28/12/2006

Rodrigo Wayland
Chile

Dear Fredy,
If he/she sends me their mail address, I can send him the requested pictures. Or it can look for me in internet.

28/12/2006

Moral Giovanni
Venezuela

we Say goodbye to the 2.006�,�,�, something concludes.
Because we achieve what we had intended for this stage, we have grown.
We take ourselves the experience that we build together and the certainty of having shared a learning that will encourage us to continue looking for that it is to continue learning of all the participants of these forums.
Grace to the community ENGORMIX.COM.
I wish them a 2.007 of a lot of happiness, and that we continue sharing information of great interest for all the foristas.
HAPPY AND I PROSPER YEAR 2.007.
VERY SINCERELY.

Agricultural I Circulate & #65533,G�,
Moral Giovanni
Director

29/12/2006

Raúl Collazzi
Uruguay

Dear:
somebody can evacuate me the question, if the resulting glicerol of the process of the biodiesel, it can be used as biomass to make work a biodigestor.
It is a problem the topic of this by-product, and this could be a solution, since it is an alcohol, it could generate methane. I would be interested their opinion in this respect.
From already thank you.

30/12/2006

Rodrigo Wayland
Chile

Sr Raúl Collazzi, responding to their consultation:

The biodiesel is obtained of the rupture hidrolítica of a triglicérido, obtaining three sour degrees and glicerol. The fatty acids are those that are used as biodiesel, and the glicerol it can be used in the industry of foods, cosmetics, for example in soaps, segurode that you have listened of the soaps of glycerine or the creams humectantes based on glycerine am.
The glycerine is broadly used in the chemical industry. The nitroglycerine is a molecule of glycerine with three molecules of nitrogen oxide replacing to the protons forming a connection ether.
Is it advisable that it blindfolds it in glicerol form, he/she has bigger value that if it uses it for biogas.

30/12/2006

ARTURO GONZALEZ
Mexico

Hello foristas. Have I read their comments and do I crumble the critics, some with cause knowledge, other enthusiasts, other mercantilists, but did a forista comment well, that at the end of everything is to eat, how well, those that have to eat, and those that don't have? That they are continued scrubbing. To speak of the field (peasant) in Latin America it is synonymous of poverty. The big merchants always have to trade, and those always poor to famish. The world won't change if we continue being GREEDY, ENVIOUS, SELFISH, PASSIVE, NEGATIVE, VIVIDORES OF THE OTHER ones. I mean those that profesionistas or superuniversidades professors are said with big holding that the knowledge was made to share it with the other ones, and that this is good to help those that fewer have. Do you believe that a great manager potentoso economically will pass it foreando in this channel? For anything! In the personal thing, I have passed my knowledge of the little thing that I have in my wealth, and that is more gain than some simple currencies or notes. This reflection is a movement of conscience. There is who step to the other ones for their personal well-being. BRAVE AND HAPPINESS to those that without waiting anything to change, they help to leave ahead not only to the nearest, they are helping to progress to their region, and for ende to their country, and as resultant, beneficiary the human being. IF we STUDY SOME CAREER it is to SERVE TO THE OTHER ones, and that same service besides will give us to eat and to live well. In Mexico there are companies that make the CHARITY, and he/she goes them very well. If they don't believe me, ask who the doctor is SIMI that came to revolutionize the market of the medicines so that they were the basic ones within reach of those that fewer have. HAPPINESS, and that GOD BLESSES THEM to ME TO ALL THE FORISTAS THIS 2007 and every year of its life. SUSTAINABLE it is also so that people live beside the progress, all the people, not only the richest economically. Greetings to all.

30/12/2006

Raúl Collazzi
Uruguay

I Thank their comment and their suggestion. But in these moments and much more in the future, the offer excess will be so big that we won't have bought buyer for that by-product. Remember that the 20 of the process are glicerol, and the figures are very big. For that reason my restlessness to look for another alternative. Thank you.

02/01/2007

Carlos Alberto Cardona Cardona
Colombia

good morning, Mr. Victor.

I thank the information of the studies carried out by the federation of coffee, and in next days that restart works people of the service of extension of my municipality, I will request them the designs of the studies of people for you enunciated.

In the two comments in that I have participated in the forum I have placed my electronic mail, but the administrators of this they have eliminated it, and my only objective is the one of receiving the information for you offered. Again I add it.

He/she would thank the administrators of the forum not to eliminate it he/she stops this way to receive from Mr. Victor the information for him offered.

02/01/2007

ARTURO GONZALEZ
Mexico

The comment that makes Carlos, and I understand it this way, when it is a person with experience in the topic tried without ends of lucre, it is good that he/she leaves us reference to communicate. We should take advantage of people that don't pursue the lucre. If me when communicating with somebody, and I see that he/she has more commercial interests that of service to the community, because I no longer contact him. I repeat, if we don't throw the hand among all, we will never advance. Latin America needs more than ever today narrowing relationships of fraternity, of fraternity. The merchants, those that trade with the hunger of the poorest, they will always continue this way and they will never change. Let us remember that the recompense always comes besides. Make the well without noticing to who, and they will see how their life will always be accompanied by the kindness of God. Therefore, I request to the administrators of this forum so valuable they allow us to leave necessary information for the interested ones. Those that want to trade that they make it in the corresponding pages. I would like to say to those in charge of this page web of Engormix they will carry out an union of associated of Engormix for the treatment of the different topics, and to carry out them in regional and international events of Latin America, like conferences, shops, exhibitions, etc. Without losing first of view the service to the other ones, an organization without ends of lucre, because spaces already exist for those that also want to trade. Good, there I leave them that proposal. A Felíz new year to all and QDB.

02/01/2007

Alirioangarita
Colombia

Thank you for the answer, Engineer Rodrigo Wayland, but do I believe that the material that he/she suggests me comes out me expensive, and would I like him to give me other possibilities reducing costs and that it is safe. He/she also wanted to know what he/she differs he/she has the vehicular gas and this that takes place in the property. Thank you for their attention, and I wait answers.
Attn.

Alirio Angarita O.

03/01/2007

Gabriel Rodriguez
Colombia

Mr. Victor
Advisory Environmental Reparation

That is the form of PARTICIPATING IN A FORUM... You can share all the ideas that he/she wants and if somebody is interested in something more... AS for their MANUAL... how fantastic... Me yes I am interested in the manual... I find very interesting.

Gabriel Rodriguez

03/01/2007

Gabriel Rodriguez
Colombia

Mr. Ariel Galetto,

For their help, the word enter in the searcher of Engormix BIODIGESTORES or BIOGAS... or in the page of YAHOO or in GOOGLE... It can also accompany the word with the country BIOGAS CONSTRUCTION... BIOGAS COLOMBIA, etc, and he/she will find more information... I believe to have seen a construction design in some page in ENGORMIX... but I am not sure when.

Gabriel Rodriguez

03/01/2007

Gabriel Rodriguez
Colombia

Mr. Ariel Galetto,

Already you where the detailed information is...
Among in the searcher of Engormix the word - Colombia - and in the second column to go to forums... to give him enter in the pc...
When it is in this page, lower until finding the title that he/she says this way:

STRICT BIORREACTOR ANAEROBICO FOR PRODUCTS OF BIOGAS...

And he/she will see that they are begun to facilitate the things... It is always good to get some note or two in the agricultural section of any BOOKSTORE... where will find many charts of by-products and details that he/she will begin to wonder empieze once to be related more with the topic.

A lot of luck.

Gabriel Rodriguez

03/01/2007

Rodrigo Wayland
Chile

Sr Alirio Angarita, in answer to their consultation:

The vehicular gas or gas natural tablet, correspond mainly to methane, and small quantities of propane and butane like pollutant. It is extracted of gas locations, and it is associated to the petroleum. The storage pressure is of about 250 atm or 3.675 pounds.

The gas of hatcheries, biogas, corresponds in a 50 -70 of methane, and other gases like dioxide of carbon and small quantities of sour sulfhídrico and it dilutes. But it doesn't contain butane or propane. As a rule, the work pressure is inferior to 1 atm, 14.7 pounds.

The gas that is usually sold in cylinders for domiciliary use corresponds to propane and butane, which can be liquefied to near pressures to 15 atm, some 220 pounds to ambient temperature.

It exists a technology that is denominated gas natural adsorbido, which allows that the gas of reactors can be busy for vehicles in drops pressures, some 40 atm, contrary to what happens with the city gas, which should be compressed in ponds to 250 atm. It uses coal activated for the storage of the gas.

In relation to the design of teams, I recommend you the following text of some 500 pág, in which different designs step appear to step, so much in brick, concrete and other materials, which I am sure will be able to find in the UN of their country, or to request a copy to this institution.

Organization of the United Nations for the Agriculture and Feeding, regional office for America and the Caribbean, 1986, “training Course and reciclaje of organic matter and biogas”, Santiago, Chile.

03/01/2007

ARTURO GONZALEZ
Mexico

it Seems that the new year he/she brings us new hopes. Happiness Mr. Rodrigo W., of these attitudes needs the world, truly I congratulate him to put within reach of the other ones its knowledge. I will also try to make myself arrive the manual of training of the UN. How easy it is, it doesn't cost anything, let us share that gold that we possess and that the other ones could not have. Again, I congratulate him. QDLB.

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