Pig Industry - Article: Production of Biogas–you Plant Centralized and Simplified - Management


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09/10/2006

Engormix.com
Argentina

Article: Production of Biogas–you Plant Centralized and Simplified

In this forum comments are made on the technical article

Produccion of Biogas–you Plant Centralized and Simplified

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09/10/2006

Mauricio Vesga Dávila
Colombia

The works of the Engineer Montanaro Produción of Biogas has more than enough they are of high utility for the agricultural sector, it interests me to know if there is some work it has more than enough production of biogas in Plants of sacrifice of animals (bovine and swinish), the resíduos organigos and the biomass abundant ameritan to evaluate this option for the handling of residual waters and solid resíduos in these plants.
MAURICIO VESGA D. Prescribes Veternario I reside in Bogotá and work in Colombia, me country

09/10/2006

Pablo Blonde
Argentina

In Argentinean it is something complicated to mix the residuals of animal production, with residuals of purification plants of having undone human cloacales, because the qualification of those undone human for law they consider them special and it would limit its use to field.

09/10/2006

Pablo Blonde
Argentina

I am devoted to diagnosis of fertility of floors, I would be interested to know the characteristics of the final residual to be able to make recommendations of application dose to field like fertilizante.gracias

09/10/2006

Roberto Montanaro
Argentina

Dear Pablo Blonde: Above all good morning and with a lot of respect I advise him that he/she reads the article thoroughly because these reactors or digestores that are illustrated in the document don't incorporate residuals cloacales of centers alone urbanos,trabajan with deyecciones zootecnicas and residual waste of rural establishments (p.ejemplo: serums lácteos),comprendo their concept but in this case it doesn't correspond to the I outline específico.Muchas Thank you.

09/10/2006

angel salmeron
Venezuela

Mr. montanaro their I articulate published, he/she has helped me to solve certain incognito ones that he/she had on this topic. it has been of thanked a lot of utility.

09/10/2006

Carlos Arango Cordoba
Colombia

do I find The topic of the biodigestores of a lot of importance and in this respect I have a restlessness I can carry out a biodigestor where it can mix organic material of bovine and swinish? or he/she has exclusivity some of them....

09/10/2006

Carlos Ernesto Botto Rosebushes
El Salvador

Engineer Roberto Montanaro, I congratulate him. Very good example of respect to the environment. Serious very good recommending it to the Central Government as to the Municipal Governments of my country (El Salvador) because it is a project of great span and cost and this way he/she would come to give a respiration to so much contamination using it for the generation of different energy types and in fact it would develop the exploitations of cattle type (bigger and menores)que is in process of sub I develop since for next year there is not increment in the cattle field inside the general budget of the nation.
As I can make ing. with all respect to have a but wide information and to be able to him to suggest and this way to be able to contribute to the world environmental reparation from my Country.
attn. Greetings

10/10/2006

Christian Rodriguez
Peru

above all, congratulations Mr. Montanaro for the I articulate. It prolongs the interest developed in the previous one I articulate on production of Biogas. I find curious that has not taken advantage of the previous question about the possibility of using waters cloacales or of slaughterhouses to feed a plant of Biogas ...En Denmark, they make it. In Colombia, they generate biogas (the Plant of Treatment of Efluentes of Cundinamarca, if I don't make a mistake, it produces Biogas).

Evidently, to calculate efficiencies and times of retention in these cases empiric charts they cannot be used (like in most of projects guided to the Agricultural sector) but rather it requires a bigger professional domain of the topic. Times of Retention of 10 days or but with volumes of efluentes of 900 m3/dia, alone ...una enormous initial investment is disheveled to apply incorrect technologies (eye that this has also happened in developed countries). Covered lagoons, CSTR, and Plug FLow is traditional technologies but of low efficiency.

On the other hand, UASB, Dry Digestores, Lixiviacion of Municipal Waste and Reactors IC,
they demonstrate a ratio of very superior conversion to the previous ones (HRT between 4 and 48 hrs) and therefore, smaller investment initial and bigger return speed in this type of Projects.
It would be interesting of including them in a next one I articulate. Returning to the topic, I believe that it would be worthwhile to deepen in the differences among the three digestores models mentioned previously (Covered Lagoon, CSTR and Plug Flow)
Is it possible to recognize in that circumstance each one of them is preferable?
Ahead of time, very grateful with their answer.

10/10/2006

Roberto Montanaro
Argentina

Dear Ing.Cristian Rodriguez: Good morning. I thank their participation in the forums of biogás production that are of high interest for their specialty.

You are an expert in the topic and help with their concepts to deepen in the temario. He/she is right in what concerns to their demarcation of the disheveled initial investment that one has to make to make work these digestores or reactors to produce only Biogas. Notice the outlines that I have presented in the concept I Use agronómico,además when existing a sobresaturación of efluentes porcícolas (as it points out it the chart of the 67 taken a census of plants) it is necessary to feed the digestores without cutting the programmed production.

These plants (most) they were projected as restructuring to a system of stock of completely full efluentes, some already had stabilization lagoons that were enlarged, the tanks of armed concrete in situ were replaced by tanks of concrete high-speed premoldeado of assembly, they left annexing those covered with PVC when checking the efficient ailación to the lost of heat with the incorporate technology.
That is to say they left experiencing the processes of biogás production with the use of mires to the fertirigación and as you he/she will have read in this I articulate it exists a proliferation of confinamientos porcícolas that absorbs the three types of reactors in great measure, therefore for my humble knowledge in this respect the election of one or another system depends on the normative one existent in each specific area due to the injection of agroindustrial efluentes or of civil mires (almost insignificant) that increase the potentiality of the efluente essentially porcícola and bovine.

Engineer Rodriguez,creo that the concepts that technically you manage they are of high contained ingenieril and I would like to deepen him in interdisciplinary form between the industrial Engineering and the civilian to be able to sum up viable projects for our means very punished by the disinformation. I insist it is urgent to work with this emprendimientos type to motorize the growth of the sector zootecnico in Latinoamerica,está all related one, integration is only needed. I send him a great hug and I am to their you order.

Ing.Roberto Montanaro

11/10/2006

Victor
Nicaragua

The technology development for the environmental reparation, it should be adapted to each place, resíduos generation and economic possibilities for their implementation. To small scale in Nicaragua and at the moment in Republic Of the Dominican Republic, we have been able to implement projects in those that mix the animal resíduos, with the beneficiary's of coffee residual waters (that are quite similar to those of sugar geniuses) and combining the treatment systems with the treatment of you excrete human.

Right now we are developing a project where residual waters of cáfé are involving (reactors anaeróbico in upward flow of 300 m3), you excrete human + bovine manures + porqueriza estíercol (50 m3). The main thing is in like it will be made the postratamiento and the use of the efluente.

I congratulate the participants of this forum, since they contribute to the popularization of treatment technology.

Victor Cantarero Pineda
advisory environmental reparation.
Nicaragua
vcantarero@yahoo.com

11/10/2006

virgilio samniego
Panama

it pleases me and I come giving siguimiento to this topic that to my it interests me enough for the swinish activity and of livestock me guataria that somebody explained to me as to build a system llamace reactor or digestor in a governable functional way for a property of 5,700 pigs and to give him an adapted uses and useful because really what I see me one doesn't eat the it could apply in my farm because to the topics that hata now and seen alone they leave me but enrredado.

11/10/2006

Adrián Lemon
Mexico

I find very interesting the I articulate and I thank the time used in the realization of the same one. For my part and in agreement with the concern shown in the lationamérica development, I have found the financear way this type of projects through the mechanism of clean development. These mechanisms grant extra revenues for concept of sale of funds of carbon to projects of capture of Methane and electric generation with renewable sources. At the moment I am developing business models to undertake projects of electric generation with the methane capture in Mexico. But we have met with transnational companies that you/they offer a sustainable project for the farms. In this sense and for any doubt or amplification of information regarding the funds of carbon accent my mail next. alimon@ceidas.org

11/10/2006

Henry Fields Gutierrez
Peru

good I find very interesting and very good q this spreads but to see the improvements q they are making in this system of creating but plants of biogas for the improvement of the production of energy of better quality good thank you for the whole imformacion and quiciera to know if this plant tanbien works with what refers of smaller animals

12/10/2006

Christian Rodriguez
Peru

Engineer Montanaro, I am flattered by their words. I thank him their deference and alone I have left to add that in this topic, we all are learning in the road. By way of rounding the idea, indeed, the ing. Civilians participate actively to the design of elements for Plants of Treatment, thanks to their contributions for the design of big reservorios and ponds for the ecualizacion of the efluentes. And about the possibility of contributing in some point, count on me that it stops that we are.
Now then, just as the colleague he/she mentions it Adrián, a great interest exists in capital form to foment the construction of big capture centers and methane destruction. Regrettably, the conditions of most of these Broker of Coal are little less than leonine. At least with the representatives that I have contacted, these the Tn considers from Equivalent CO2 to 5 US $, when in the international market the funds are quoted above the 15 US $...
Returning to the topic of the construction of plants of Biogas, Mr. Victor's comment Cantaredo is a typical example of the Industrialization of the systems of Treatments of Efluentes (UASB) where mix different organic loads of characteristic dissimilar for an integral handling. In Colombia, the company Biotec had a capital paper for the resurgence (or one could say salvage) of this technology, to the to have been very bad used by a group of Sanitary Engineers that you/they applied this knowledge, in the construction of big projects that you/they never fulfilled the offered yields. Although for the design of the Biodigestor it is used some rules you practice very simple, an entire very complicated design methodology exists that is centered, want you or not, in the homogenizacion of the system and its control capacity. A plant designed to be operated manually, the risk runs of collapsing. Eye that not alone it is a comment. It has happened and but times of what is recognized openly.
As for the digestores variety, all can end up fulfilling the fact of producing Biogas, alone that some are but exposed to fail that others. The technology of each one of them, predisposes them for certain conditions, improving this way its efficiency. If some participant, has interest in obtaining biogas like thermal source for some tasks (to cook, to heat water for the showers), the mechanism is very simple and the investment is tiny. If on the other hand, what is sought is to replace energy deficiencies that commit other investments (Heating of galpones of chickens, boilers for teams of having pasteurized, Treatment of Efluentes for demands of the sanitary authorities) then, the design should be careful with the characteristics of the waste and to consider additional teams to reduce the range of the variables (zarandas, desarenadores, desnatadores, etc) and this way to be sure that the bacterias will receive oneself diet (or very similar) every day. It is for that reason that the Biodigestor under these conditions, represents a strong investment and mostly, its control system is automated (most of times, the companies don't offer copies of the programming). To the colleague of Ica, I mention him that I have designed projects for a farm of guinea pigs, without more problems. Even the I found Casablanca, it maintains a digestor Chinese type in Pachacamanc, Lima with the help of this type of manure and ProCabra, maintains another in its farm model, in Lima.
For the rest of the Forum, greetings and thank you to assist me.

12/10/2006

Victor
Nicaragua

I am in total agreement with the Engineer Rodríguez. The certificates of reduction of emissions have become a myth for the domestic economies of our Latin America, since we are in total dependence of the formuladores of projects that have up as starting point transactions of the 10,000 tons of CO2 that it is where one has the balance point for the formulation cost and certification that he/she walks for but of US $100,000.00.

I differ a little on the manual operation, since I am firm believer that the biodigestión technology depends but its success of the human factor. In operation of plants we have given ourselves bill that under quite similar conditions of operation automated in the recirculation of efluentes a lot of responsibility they have it the operators. In our systems in Nicaragua operate systems of up to 300 m3 with peasants' children that surrender completely to the operation of the systems and it has been quite profitable.

Greetings to all the members of the forum

12/10/2006

federico adolf kleisinger
Argentina

Mr. Montanaro:Existe equipámiento but economic, for establishments of small dimenciones, where the deyecciones production is therefore of smaller volume and that he/she can autoabastecerce of biogas the establishment.
Greetings.

12/10/2006

Eduardo Dangond
Colombia

it is EXCELLENT THE I ARTICULATE, ATTRACTIVENESS THE SYSTEM BUT it SUFFERS OF THE ITEM OF COSTS OF MAINTENANCE AND THE VALUE OF INVESTMENT FOR each one OF THE SYSTEMS THE MANUALS AND THE TEAMS .DEBERÌA to BE ADDED WITH THIS IMPORTANT INFORMATION FOR A bigger UNDERSTANDING AND to BE CONVINCED OF IMPLEMENTING THIS SYSTEM.

IF THE AUTHOR'S IDEA IS MASIFICAR THIS INNOVACCION IT SHOULD SUPPLEMENT ITS I ARTICULATE WITH THE INFORMATION ON THE COMPANIES THAT YOU/THEY SELL THE MANUAL SYSTEMS AND TEAMS SOPHISTICATED MA

EDUARDO DANGOND
COLOMBIA

12/10/2006

Javier Dario Bahamon Packs of cards
Colombia

it is interesting to know that the popularization of this technology type this at world level and it is continued making investigation in this respect, I agree on the systems and the use of the matters for the production of biogas, but which is the cost of this infrastructure and which is the benefit, be environmental that is to say economic, this should be continued measuring to be able to not evaluate alone in the economic part but in the environmental one that this so deteriorada,por example in our country.

It is of a lot of help this I articulate and it should be continued investigating to make it but accessible to those less beneficiaries as it is our case in Colombia

Thank you

12/10/2006

Jorge I. Samaniego Beltràn
Mexico

HELLO TO ALL...
I want to comment them that in our region we are making gas (lp) for domestic use, and in each time of aging or of fermentation, he/she takes place more and more inflammable.
With this experiment you participated in the National competition of Experiments and Apparatuses of Physics, at National level in the city of Mexico DF.

12/10/2006

Ronald Of Peace
Guatemala

I have been reading all the answers to the article of production of biogas, which I should say is very good. The only experience that I have with biodigestores is the observation of some in Guatemala, but that they are used at domestic level, they either produce gas for use of the property or land and payment for sale or it stops own consumption, a production system doesn't exist to scale so big as those that have mentioned many of the participants in the forum. Maybe due to the high cost that supposes their implementation. In any way, I would like to see information on how to build a small biodigestor.
And again thank you to share so much information.

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