Pig Industry - Article: Design of Biodigestores - Management


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06/12/2006

Rodolfo Trujillo Diaz
Peru

Hello Carmen Botello,te comments that of the day 3 at January 7 the 2007 and of the 10 at the 14 of the 2007, courses were dictated in the reservation
of the forest of fog Huatusco in the hotelito The Narrow canyons www.bosquedeniebla.com.mx has more than enough construction in earth compactada as well as production of organic payments, biol obtained ,biosol of a polipropileno biodigestor that is to say plastic, and it takes a ring in the entrance I saw it
for picture for my part I will be present to learn a little but, in my country I am finishing a dome biodigestor
fixed Chinese model of bricks and armed concrete and lattice of metallic mesh measures 12mt3 I am to finish it aprox in
1 week.
fraternally Rodolfo Trujillo.

12/12/2006

Raúl Collazzi
Uruguay

I find very interesting the topic. Now then, as biomass you can use the resulting glicerol of the biodiesel production?
From already, thank you for the concepts to vertir.

12/12/2006

MAYRON MATUTE
Ecuador

I Want to know what time it delays the biodigestor in producing useful gas for the industry, and if this gas needs some treatment before using it as combustible gas.

12/12/2006

Pablo Infants Chávez
Peru

Hello Mayron Matute: when you pull up a biodigestor producing the head gases it can take around 3 to 4 weeks, depending on the very that the cargastes, the first gases will be poor being normalized with lapsing of the time until it reaches the correct percentage of methane in the gas that should be between 60 and 70 percent depending on the sustrato with which you feed to the digestor. then you will feed him, as much as possible, daily you will have gas every day and also your biol for your chacra, the time that the sustrato remains inside the biodigestor for its degradation will depend on the temperature with which you work the biodigestor, if your biodigestor works to ambient temperature, him but probable it is that, depending on the temperature of the place, it can take a long time up to 120 days until the sustrato is completely degraded, and this can know it smelling the sustrato that leaves the biodigestor, if he/she has bad scent it means that the degradation (fermentation) it has not finished and it requires but time of permanency, when your digestor heats it at 37ºC the permanency it will be of 30 days and if you heat it at 55ºC alone it will be of 15 days.
The biogas contains around 2 percent of sulfurous anhydride what makes it toxic for the system respìratorio of the animals, and it destroys the apparatuses of metallic where he/she burns.
This sulfurous anhydride can take off or injecting him very well a quantity of air dosed so that the oxygen oxidizes the anhydride and and decant the I sulfurate in the mass of the sustrato (this system is used in big industrial biodigestores) or it can also be made flow through a filter containing ferric oxide, this element retains the sulfuros.
Thank you to read my comments.

12/12/2006

Rodolfo Trujillo Diaz
Peru

Friend Pablo: I am in the final phase of the construction of the biodigestor of dome fixed Chinese model. I plan to make a pre-compost, that is to say to decompose the organic matter in cord and for layers aeróbicamente for 45 days, it stops then to introduce it in the biodigestor and to add him fresh rumen, to obtain gas to the 6º day it foresaw control of the increase of the pressure in the handmade gauge. My biodigestor has 12mt3, 4metros of diameter x 2.50 of wall + 1metro of dome or dome, the opening to the means of the dome is of 90cmt. What tube diameter for the exit of the gas it recommends me: 1/2, 1 pulg? Because I want to connect the trap sulfuros retenedora. Very grateful ahead of time for their collaboration, being of you.
fraternally.

Rodolfo Trujillo

13/12/2006

Pablo Infants Chávez
Peru

Hello friend Trujillo: I congratulate him a lot for the achievement in the construction of their biodigestor. What I don't understand, and here we are to expose our ideas and experiences, is it why one has to make compost to feed to the digestor? In none of the literatures that I have it is spoken of previous compostaje of those undone organic. I would understand you if you tell me that you soak the organic matter as previous step before putting it to the digestor, because the hidrólisis is the first phase in the formation of the biogas. Good, but like one says in our Peruvian earth, each one knows like bush their fleas.
I recommend you that you use for the exit of the biogas a tube of PVC of 1 inch of diameter, so that there is not a lot of resistance to the friction, and don't forget to put him a filter with chip of rusty iron so that it retains the sulfuros.
A practical way to know the presence of the sulfuros in the biogas is to make flow the biogas inside a mass of alcohol yodado, in the measure that becomes milky, it indicates the presence of sulfurous anhydride.
I wish you a lot of luck with your digestor.

13/12/2006

Rodolfo Trujillo Diaz
Peru

Friend Pablo,muchas thank you for its aporte,creo is a small confusion for that doesn't end up being compost, but precompost
if we think of the easiness of carrying out the mixture of the payment in combined layers of guano with waste organicos(paja, gras
leaves etc) it is a lot but I practice and economico,a the time the pre compost enters to the biodigestor with a temperature min de+ - 45grs depending the time of the year altitude and latitude of the place where you realize and of course it is necessary to soak him daily and there is different technical, and if we add him fresh rumen for 12mt3 300kg we obtain the gas very quickly
since this rumen contains the bacterias anaerobicas that are of great help for the prompt digestion, besides obtaining -
you gratuitously in any camal. Soon I will have pictures and videos to teach them to all the interested ones in being built a
biodigestor and this way to obtain organic payments, and clean energy for everything. www.inkasbees.com
another question if to store gas(balones,tanques) we have to liquefy it that is to say to freeze it to less 165 degrees like
we can end up carrying out it in a handmade and economic way.
being of you friend very grateful countryman.
fraternally Rodolfo Trujillo.

13/12/2006

Pablo Infants Chávez
Peru

Friend Trujillo: not yet I am cooked the idea of making pre or compost of those undone before feeding to the digestor but I already told you each one sab.......
The alone rumen of the bovine one is used to pull up the digestor, later it is not necessary....
I have already said on the topic of the licuación of the biogas, I suggest you that you revise the contributions.
Many successes

13/12/2006

Rodolfo Trujillo Diaz
Peru

he/she is This way friend Pablo I will use the alone bovine rumen for the outburst, I will also feed weekly the biodigestor with a guano mixture but it dilutes 1-3 and to have biol semanalmente,por favor could send this way me the information of as liquefying the one
metano,por that revises the 4 previous pags and I didn't find anything, for what I have understood it is necessary to compress 600
veces,si a refrigerator to full can give me -25 -30 he/she would have to manufacture me a serpentine in cascade but using some
another component ammonia not you favor helps to decipher this incognito one and this way to save us time and efforts
now the pencas of tunas has the particularity of concentrating big nitrogen volumes and methane I particularly have field 5000 pencas 1 there is. another alternative of producing big quantities of methane and nitrogen
it is using the pencas like biomass, what wanted that somebody contribution if he/she can it is as separating the nitrogen of the methane
be worth the rebundancia in the way but economic and to small or micro climbs there is that empesar for something.
attn Rodolfo.

14/12/2006

Rodolfo Trujillo Diaz
Peru

speaking a little but of the energy and heating power of the tuna or nopal we could contribute the siguente,la decomposition
of the organic acids it is generated by a process encimatico that acts on the organic acids to a temperature of among 30 -40 degrees celcius, being able to obtain x dry gram the 60cm3 of I hydrogenate to the second day speak and to the 10 days
the division of the methane that he/she gives 300cm3 approximately for dry gram begins.
one can obtain 80 of methane and 20 of co2 and easily to neutralize it when passing the co2 popr a trap of water.
Taking out calculations with 3 kg of dry pencas 1 mt of gas that is similar to 10 could take place approximately kw-h and if
one has it produces 30 tn waste to the año,esto it is equal at about 150 kw-h day.
Now if obtained the methane wanted to liquefy it I am happened the siguente,construir a tank of armed concrete of 1-2 -
3 mt3 or but with roof dome and to fill it with nitrogen liquido,o to buy a cryogenic tank (AGA in Peru) to a temperature of - 161 degrees, arriving to this point ar a hairspring in the tank for where the gas methane reflects of
such a form that passes to state liquidates to be stored in balonaes or tanks of a degree of thickness or millimeters that it resists the pressure and without the necessity of having bombs believe to the pressure that generates the gas, avoiding this way possible accidents or explosions because the nitrogen liquidates it is inert and he/she doesn't react with anything to see if somebody cheers up to contribute something but to arrive at the end of the process of having stored of the gas methane, for use industrial,automotriz etc etc etc
fraternally Rodolfo Trujillo.

14/12/2006

Pablo Infants Chávez
Peru

Hello Rodolfo. It seems that I wrote my comments in another page, I believe that it is Generation of biogas, but in any event you tell me that your digestor is of Chinese design, and I find that he/she should have around 10 m3 of sustrato capacity. He/she looks, we in the biodigestores complex to the south of Lima, generate near 4.200m3/d of biogas. However, it is not profitable to liquefy it and to pack it.
To liquefy the biogas, the first thing that should be made is to subject it to a laundry to remove him all the sludges, then the methane of the CO2 should be separated so that it is pure methane. Under these conditions, the critical pressure so that the methane was liquefied it is of 65 Bar. The bottles for the one packed of biogas they are special to support discharges pressures. If you want to liquefy the biogas without separating the CO2, you require a pressure of around 200 Bar. For this operation you require compressors of great power and of special design.
At the present time situations are giving that will change our nutritious habits in a very near future, the man will compete for their foods with the fuels for the railcars. At the present time it has gone up the price of the corn, of that corn that you/they feed the chickens, of the corn ethanol that is an alcohol that is good as fuel for the railcars also takes place. The same thing will happen to the eatable oils that will use them to manufacture the biodisel and other products.
At the present time in Germany it is managed the concept a lot NAWARO (Nachwachsende Rohstoffe) that could translate you in our language like plants of continuous growth. Until about 10 years ago behind was unthinkable to think that a biodigestor could do without of the guanos of the animals, at the present time this concept step to the history. Today in day they exist many biodigestores that work exclusively with such vegetables as the chala, potatoes, beets, that of more acceptance is the chala.
You speak to me of the pencas, of course these vegetables should contain sugars and proteins, and they should be very appropriate for the generation of the biogas.
The accent so that they make fly their imaginations.

14/12/2006

Rodolfo Trujillo Diaz
Peru

Friend Pablo, very grateful for their answer. I understand that for the liquefaction it is necessary to eliminate sludges, to dry it among other, and it is something complex. However, as many big projects of all nature began to small scales, micro scales, in the case of camisea, so that it is profitable the export and load capacity, are to liquefy it.
Now, in the case of the production of biogas only using pencas of tunas or nopal, we would only obtain a biogas with 80 of methane and 20 co2 that using a simple trap of water, it is eliminated being pure methane.
Now, this methane introducing it in a cryogenic tank to -161 degrees, with liquid nitrogen, it would be liquefied. You friend Pablo, he/she has carried out the final process, that is to say the criogenización of the methane, and to return him liquid.
Let us imagine the process of obtaining of essential oils, a still, doesn't interest the size, the process it is the same one. To the bottom it dilutes, then the leaves or grasses, all this boils, and for haulage the vapor extracts the essential oil that then passes to the phase two, in another recipient with constantly cooled water, containing a hairspring to the means for where he/she reflects, the vapor is condensed obtaining essential oil and it dilutes that easily he/she separates. I wanted that me of their opinion if it has experienced this process of criogenizado of the methane practically, and if it has used liquid nitrogen to achieve it. As everything you can experience to micro or small scale. What you say.
Fraternally.

Rodolfo

15/12/2006

Marin Aybar Valencia
Peru

Hello Pablo, good day. He/she receives the cordial greeting of a 25 year-old youth, natural of Chincha. I have read the information that you have presented, and I find very interesting, and mainly esclarecedor, mainly for who interests him the topic. And like I have a small farm of guinea pigs, I cheered up to carry out one in the following way:
In a cylinder of 200 liters (Normal cylinders of Water), I introduced the guano of the humidified guinea pig, blended with forage. Naturally the Cylinder is tightly sealed with an insurance. I have also made an exit for the consistent gas in a pipe with a key in passing. Newly I have finished it yesterday's day 14/12//2006, and my question is:
1. - how long do I have to wait so that the biogas takes place? Keeping in mind that it is to atmosphere temperature.
I have seen in other models that use the exit of the gas toward a recipient with water.
2. - for what reason does that serve?
I thank you in advance to respond my questions, and congratulations.

15/12/2006

Pablo Infants Chávez
Peru

Hello Marin: That good that you animastes to build your small biodigestor, finds me that you have loaded it with a lot of dry substance, what enters to the digestor should have the consistency of a broth, mormalmente the dry organic substance it should be alone the 11por hundred of the broth the rest is water. What construistes is what is denominated system Bacht is loaded and he/she is made work until it finishes the fermentation, in your case it seems that it will never start up because you have not inoculated him with the necessary bacterias, you should go to the camal and that they give you the rumen of the bovine livestock, there they are the bacterias, when they give you the rumen you should put it in a recipient him but sealed hermenticamente, you wrap it in a bag plastic quarter note for the transport ,lo mixtures with the one undone organic and you wait some days until the bacteria empieze to feed and to reproduce.
Luck

16/12/2006

Marin Aybar Valencia
Peru

Thank you Pablo for your suggestion, and I really want to be appreciated for that are the only person in all the forums that I have found that I really respond to their participants.

Good in fact not wise that the iva in the digestor had the aspect of a broth, him mine because it is totally different it is alone the guano humidified by what doesn't resemble each other in anything, that is for what had seen in pictures in other side, and that aspect had. Now I will carry out it according to your suggestions.

Is the rumer now, the guano of the bovine livestock, does this have to mix it alone with the water, or with what I already have that the guano of the guinea pig is, clear this giving him the appearance of the broth and to seal it tightly?

After this as much as time delayed on the average to take place the biogas.

Thank you for your answers Pablo, we will continue in contact

16/12/2006

Rodolfo Trujillo Diaz
Peru

Friend Martin ,concuerdo with tigo and he/she also wanted to give you a humble contribution, you should use among 35 to 40 guano kg +
3.5kg of rumen fresco,ahora divide your biodiogestor in 4 parts equals a part of guano two parts of water and the part
remaining for the accumulation of the gas, you also have to condition a gauge that will be the one that indicates you little by little
the increase of the pressure of the gas as the bacterias anaerobicas comiensen to alimentarse,tambien could acondicio -
nar a trap of water that it is a botelle from 1,5 to 2 liters with a small window in the superior part that would serve you
as desfoge valve, half of the bottle he/she has to be with water, and to couple to the mouth a mangera that leaves the one
biodigestor and enter to the bottle until colliding with the water and I list.
I wait that of something it serves you this humble contribution we are to help us.
fraternally Rodolfo

16/12/2006

Pablo Infants Chávez
Peru

Marin: the guano of the bovine one is not rumen, in the digestive system of the bovine one that is a system anaeróbico, a series of bacterias that you/they go degrading to the foods that it consumes the aninal, live it is certain when the animal defecates bacterias that die to be in contact with the air at the little time also come out and therefore with the oxygen, and for that the light doesn't support it and they die, for that reason it is that the digestores inwardly should be completely dark.
For these reasons you should go to the camal and to request that they give you the contained ruminal of the animal with preference the content of the I clot for that reason it is that I told you to pack it very hermetic and to cover it with a black plastic.
Luck

19/12/2006

Raúl Collazzi
Uruguay

Don Pablo, very good its report. Could I inform if the resulting glicerol of the production of Biodiesel, is good to put in a biodgestor?
I thank him their answer.

Raúl Collazzi

19/12/2006

Marin Aybar Valencia
Peru

Thank you Rodolfo:
A pleasure of knowing you and of before hand thank you for your suggestions. It is very important for my your suggestions, now already I have a panorama but esclarecedor with regard to the biomass and with regard to the bottle of water, I thank it to you seriously rodolfo
Since I have read and I have knowledge about the biodigestores I am interested a lot the topic although my professional career doesn't have anything to do with this field, But looking for information and knowing people like your I have been able to carry out this small work.

Now I will apply the measures that you gave me, to fill the biodigestor, for I request you to it to continue in contact.

Don Pablo: now I was confunfiendo with regard to the rumen, I have had to revise biology books to see this part, but now I understand better and I realize the difference among that that this in the rumen and the guano characteristic of the bovine one. I will look for it in the camales, God willing he/she is lucky, ah and I also suppose he/she has read the rodolfo comment, to who I thank a lot. That opinion has in this respect Don Pablo?

Thank you to both for their suggestions and comments.

19/12/2006

Pablo Infants Chávez
Peru

Hello Raúl Collazi: I don't know the process for the preparation of the biodiesel, neither you that it is the glicerol, but what I can tell you is that if it is a derived of a vegetable oil, you can him vertir in the digestor, the oil is one of the sustratos that generates a lot of biogas.
Luck

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